Buying a new PC - spec advice wanted please!

[shanboi]

ok, so yesterday i tried to run Splinter Cell - pandora tomorrow on my current comp, which is too shabby gfx wise. Naturally i decided to buy a whole new computer hehe

I have about $1,000 aussie to spend. I know stuff about computers, but i dont know much about hardware and compatability.

Any of you guru's be able to throw together a little bit of a spec for me!

My mate suggested id be able to pick up about a p4 3.3ghz box with 512-1024MB ram, raedon 9600XT 256mb gfx, 120gb HDD etc.

He said something about either that processor or a 64bit Athlon 3.0ghz - which will do better?

any and all advice is welcome!
thanks people

shan

[Yawgm0th]

You could certainly get a nice P4 box or even a nice Athlon XP box for that. However, it would be in your best interest to save up a few hundred more and get an A64-based computer.
It will run faster than a more expensive P4 computer, and is more upgradable. It would also be a good idea to wait until PCI express motherboards come out. However, if you don't want to wait and get something more powerful, and more easily upgradable, just say so. :wink:
BTW, what is your current video card and system specs?

[shanboi]

current spec isnt really worth upgrading.

Its not really a system designed to handle games.

Current is something like AMD athlon 1.3ghz, 256mb ram, 32mb vid card, 70gb combined hdd space...

I figure if i were gonna shell out $300 for the vid card, might as well shell out all together and just get a new box

And yeah - ive heard mixed stories bout 64 bit. some people say that it will run better, faster etc. others say that until other hardware is running faster you wont notice much, if any difference in performance. Good for future upgrades, not so much for here and now.

spec anyone?

[shanboi]

64Bit Solution
================
CPU: Athlon 64 3000 - $320
MB: Asus K8V-Deluxe - $225
RAM: 512MB PC3200 Samsung - $140
Case: AOpen QF50A - $110
GFX: Gigabyte ATI 9600XT 256MB - $285

Total: $1080


32 Bit Solution
==================
CPU: Athlon 32 3200 - $315
MB: Asus A7N8X-X - $92
RAM: 512MB PC3200 Samsung - $140
Case: AOpen QF50A - $110
GFX: Gigabyte ATI 9600XT 256MB - $285

Total: $942

All prices in aussie

[Yawgm0th]

There are several problems with those ideas....
The prices are insane.... You have an Athlon XP listed as $5 AU less than a A64 3200..... If you link to a decent A64 3200 at that price I would be suprised. That's around $50 U.S. less than what Newegg has it for. And you can get an XP 3200 for closer to $250 AU. A 9600XT for that price? I think not. That's about $210 U.S. You can get a 9800 Pro for about that much. A 9600XT will be in the $150-190 USD range.

A 9800 Pro or better would be nice, anyway. With an Athlon 64, anything short of a 9800 Pro really won't take full advantage of the rest of the system in many games. That said, a 9600XT would be ideal if you really needed to save that money....

That case comes with a 300W PSU... For either of those comps at least 400W would be neccessary.

Getting an A64 with that RAM is kind of wasting money. PC3500 CAS 2 from a different brand would take much better advantage of the processor.

You forgot a whole bunch of cooling stuff. Mainly the processor HSF.

Spending over $900 AU on an Athlon XP-based comp is kind of dumb. At that price range, a P4 system would probably be better, but anything over that and you should just get an A64 anyway.

And yeah - ive heard mixed stories bout 64 bit. some people say that it will run better, faster etc. others say that until other hardware is running faster you wont notice much, if any difference in performance. Good for future upgrades, not so much for here and now.

An A64 is good here and now, and we'll be very good for years to come. You need a very high-end, expensive P4 to top even an A64 3200, and even the top-of-the-line P4s won't top an A64 FX in much of anything. Plus, they cost more....

Here is what I would suggest:
Edit: if increasing your budget beyond $1000 AU is impossible (even if only slightly), say so. I could think up a good Athlon XP system pretty quickly. Otherwise, continue reading....
Damn, I was going to provide links, but I'm pretty sure Newegg doesn't ship to Australia....
Expensive version:
Western Digital Raptor 74GB 10000RPM SATA Drive - $210 (US, I will convert the total)
OEM Athlon 64 3200 - $270
Dual Channel Muskin 1 GB (512MB x 2) PC3500 CAS 2 - $270
OEM Radeon 9800 Pro - $220
Arctic Silver Thermal Compound - $7
ZALMAN CNPS7000A-Cu Pure Copper CPU Cooler (just an example, any socket 754 HSF will do) - $40
Thermaltake Silver XASER III (420W PSU) - $114
SOYO nForce 3 socket 754 with onboard audio, LAN, SATA, and RAID - $130 (just an example, lots of good motherboards out there)
$1251 total USD
About $1700 AUS
To get much closer to your current budget:
Change HDD to 36 GB 10000RPM Western Digital, get a 9600XT instead of 9800 Pro, a slightly cheaper case and motherboard, a cheaper HSF, cheaper arctic silver ($7 is pushing it), 512 MB instead of 1GB of RAM (can always get another set of sticks later).
Doing this should drop the price to about $900 USD. That's about $1250 AU. Maybe $1300 tops. If you look around (give me a good Aussie hardware site and I'll help out a bit), you might be able to get it that low or better. That will give you an incredibly fast, very upgradable system that would be considered powerful for years to come.
I can give you exact links ATM if you have some way of getting U.S. hardware.... Otherwise I need to know good Aussie sites to help.

[shanboi]

Hey - thanks for the reply

As for the prices, i have a mate who used to be a techhie of sorts. He gets things at roughly wholesale or distributor prices from where he used to work.

I spoke to him last night, and i think we are going with a 400W power supply, so a different case to the one i listed

HDD isnt on there because i have a couple spare here. For starters il just throw a 40GB drive in there cos most of my data/mp3's etc are saved to a central server.. so i can get by without it just fine

RAM is always upgradable. If i want to shell out another $140 aussie i can pick up a second 512MB stick, easy peasy.

And yep thats the correct price for the 9600XT - possibly even cheaper. Thats the listed price from this wholesaler in aus, and when he calls his people to actually do some dealing he tells me it could go even cheaper

I opted for the 64 bit solution. Bought the motherboard last night for about $225 including shipping - so the wheels are in motion!

Thanks for the advice man, keep it coming

[Yawgm0th]

I was saying you had that 9600XT overpriced.

RAM is always upgradable. If i want to shell out another $140 aussie i can pick up a second 512MB stick, easy peasy.

Everything is always upgradable....
However, you won't want to ever "just pick up another stick." You should always go dual channel when possible. Start with the 512 I suggested or something similar (512MB PC3500 CAS2 from a different brand).
What drive are you putting in this? Either the 36GB or 74GB Raptor would be best. If your just throwing in a spare drive, that could be really stupid. If your throwing in some 5400RPM drive or something, you just wasted a lot of money on a system. If your just throwing in some IDE 7200RPM 2MB cache drive, your not taking full advantage of your system. A SATA drive equal to or greater than 7200RPM 8MB cache would be best. That Western Digital is quite good, in fact. I guess you can start with that drive now, but you really should get one of those Western Digitals. The point is not the storage, it's the speed. A slow drive can ruin a system. Whatever your drive is, you probably won't end up using it for anything but storage in the long run. It wil slow you down, otherwise.

I opted for the 64 bit solution. Bought the motherboard last night for about $225 including shipping - so the wheels are in motion!

What motherboard? What chipset and built-in stuff did it have? $225 AU is rediculously high for a motherboard. That's about $165 U.S. The motherboard I just threw in as an example was about $130, and overpriced IMO. Unless you got something really nice, you probably paid too much. Anyway, a link to the motherboard would be nice.

[shanboi]

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=1532

^^ the motherboard

As for the HDD, thx for the advice bro. il check what the drives spec actually is

[Yawgm0th]

Nice motherboard, actually. Maybe a little overpriced, but I think you'll be happy with it in the long run. :wink:
And if you think it won't be too much more expensive, more than 400W PSU would be nice. A 480W would be safest I think. But if you can't afford it, I think you'll probably live with just a 400W.

[shanboi]

sorry im posting on all different forums and i cant keep up on all of them hehe

Yep i think we are going with a 400W PSU, not the 300 i listed there. Not sure exactly which one yet though

Thats a good price for the board... best i found elsewhere was about $240-270

thats 208 plus shipping... so 225 total at my door


// HDD is IBM, 7200 RPM. not sure what the cache is. Thats not the spare drive in this comp, thats just a spare drive. This one could be better or worse, il check when i do the change

Wheres chache size written? whats the abbreviation for cache on the HDD. saw **** like CHS etc

[Yawgm0th]

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=13-131-490&depa=0

If it were from an Australian place, it would be less than $200 AU after shipping.
You realize that motherboard of yours comes with on-board WiFi, right? That explains the price increase, but did you need it?
Doesn't matter though....

Yep i think we are going with a 400W PSU, not the 300 i listed there. Not sure exactly which one yet though

Let me try to put it another way:
You can't possibly power anything that's going to play newer games with a 300W power supply. For an Athlon 64 system, you need at least 400W. More might even be neccessary. It's good that you appear to be thinking about a 400W PSU, but it shouldn't even be something you consider an option. Ideally, you will have a power supply over 400 Watts. Here are a few cases available from Newegg that you could look for, with included PSUs:

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-156-135&depa=0

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-144-019&depa=0

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-144-018&depa=0

Those are nice cases, with nice cooling and a good amount of power. The cheaper one is there in case you get cheap. However, having 6 fans included with the case will be really nice for cooling.
Of course, you could get a PSU separate. If you (or your friend) can find a nice 400W (or better) PSU and a case without one (preferably with several fans included, though), that would be good.

Edit:

HDD is IBM, 7200 RPM. not sure what the cache is. Thats not the spare drive in this comp, thats just a spare drive. This one could be better or worse, il check when i do the change

Wheres chache size written? whats the abbreviation for cache on the HDD. saw **** like CHS etc

I don't remember, but I imagine it's 2MB. You could check IBMs web site, or there might be some program (can't think of any off the top of my head). Chances are it's 2MB. It should be good enough, for now. However, when you can afford it, either of those 10000 RPM SATA drives would be ideal for games, other applications, and your operating system. The IBM drive would be great for file storage.

[shanboi]

SEEK TIME (MS): 8.5ms
CACHE: 2MB
RPM: 7200 RPM
SIZE (GB): 40 GB
INTERFACE TYPE: ATA/100
CONNECTOR PIN: 40 pin / 80 wire IDE
Idle noise output: 3.0 Bels

Thats for the IBM drive i have spare. I dont know what the drive in my PC is exactly, im guessing newer than that one.. il see when i pull apart this comp to swap over comps. No biggy

As for the case - i plan on sticking with an aussie supplier. I want to get this done sooner rather than later. I will be goin with a 400watt psu and il be gettin a mid range case, pretty stock standard but decent namebrand parts.

Again - cheers for the advice - keep it comin!

[Yawgm0th]

Sounds good...
You can use that HDD. It's not bad. Later on, as I said, you'll want that SATA as your programs/OS drive and the spare for files.

Other than that you should be good...
9600XT
A64 3200
HSF
PC3500 CAS2 512MB or 1GB (dual channel, make sure it's two identical sticks pacakged together)

I hope you like graphic, demanding games...
:mrgreen:

[shanboi]

hehe, thats not my system tho! thats a lil better

Mines gonna be

9600XT
A64 3000
PC3200 512 or 1GB RAM depending on how much my mate saves me when it actually all goes thru

should run most **** pretty well yeah?

[Yawgm0th]

Don't get a 3000. Spend the extra to get the 3200.
Just make sure you get dual channel RAM. PC3200 or PC3500 work, but you'll have a huge performance drop if you don't take advantage of dual channel. You do need a heat sink/fan for your CPU.... You're also going to need a thermal compound for the CPU, such as arctic silver.